You're right. It didn't slow down twinking if you wanted to throw the money into repairs, I was mistaken about that. What it did was make it more difficult to throw high level items into the newbie economy making low level items worthless and causing mudflation.

You know, some high level is wandering around the newb area and says, here ya go, have this sword that's 10 levels above you. You could use it, but it would decay quickly, and you couldn't afford to keep it repaired.

You could just use it until it was junk, or hang on to it until you leveled enough to use it properly, but it wouldnt' replace the loot and crafted items appropriate for your level.

Not only did the items decay more quickly when they were above your level, but they were also capped in effectiveness. Giving a level 5 a level 50 sword, it wouldn't just be destroyed quickly, but it would not be much more effective than using a level 8 sword.

See I think crafting is the way to go over raiding. I like to give the players a choice and a goal to make and wear a item. Instead of the random factor were a player will go through a long dungeon to kill a boss that may or may not drop the item they are looking for.

A few games out there have opted for systems like that. The only problem with putting something like this in a class-based gear-upgrading game is that a large portion of the players out there like raiding for items these days (set in their ways from the modern, post-WoW MMO era), and are really not as interested in crafting. And since not everyone will pursue crafting, that makes the item trade largely cash-oriented, forcing players to concern themselves with gold rather than content. That typically creates a very fast burnout rate as players almost can't help themselves from doing what is most repetitive and profitable rather than what is most fun.

However, for non-class-based, non-gear-upgrading games, it would work out much better.

Some players despise crafting and don't want to be bothered with finding a crafter. They'd rather have instant gratification. That having been said, high end raid drops in numerous games drop tokens or molds which must then be turned in for class specific items. If you replace those molds or tokens with a rare crafting component, and you make the other components for that recipe easier to get, then players would basically get a boss drop, give it to a crafter and have their item made. It wouldn't be that much different than turning in the mold to a quest NPC, except that it would encourage crafting and interaction.

The downside is that players would need to have a crafter make the item for them, instead of just talking to an NPC. You'd probably want to have an interface where players could give items to a crafter without actually trading them, and the crafter could then use the items in the temporary trade space to craft. This way players know they aren't getting ripped off.

It doesn't have to be complicated at all. With an auction house, players simply put their mats up for sale, and use the money to buy crafted items.

I never looked at it that way

That works fine for most purposes. If things are on the open market crafters would buy and make the items and then sell them for a profit. What I was referring to was people who got items looted and wanted to have them turned in, simliar to turning in an armor mold.

What I was referring to was players needing something created but who didn't want to give their item to a crafter because they were suspicious of being ripped off. That is particularly an issue issue if you can create multiple grades of an item. Maybe the crafter tells them "damn only made the worst grade". Having a crafter interface allows you to give them the item to be used for the crafting combine and see the actual result.

That happened all the time in a few games I played. In early Ragnarok International, you could not tell if a crafter standing next to you had failed an item upgrade (which resulted in the item being destroyed) or had succeeded. Players wanted crafters to upgrade their items all the time, and some of the crafters would lie and say the item was destroyed and keep it. Also, some crafters in Final Fantasy XI started a despicable practice of adding a disclaimer to their services "+1 results are extra". So they would take the materials and craft the item, and if it ended up being a +1 (which could sometimes be worth 5 - 10x more) result, they would ask for some huge amount of money since "+1 results are extra". If the person having the item made couldn't pay, which they usually couldn't since they were asking so much, the crafter would supply them with a normal quality they already had made. So the crafter basically got the chance to get a rare +1 item without risking their own materials. It made the playerbase and crafters so divided that it almost destroyed the economy.

So I am definitely a fan of allowing players to keep their materials and only offer them to the crafter to make an item, not to hold.

I can see having the regular drops and the crafted pieces that would use a raid drop. the regular "Alagar's BreastPlate" would be a drop, but give a crafter a shot at "Alagar's Breastbone". this could be crafted into a "BreastPlate of Alagar"... a crafted item thats simular but slightly different. if they dont want to craft, make them collect...... 1 BreastPlate of Alagar, 1 adamantium block, 4 xxxx, 2xxx and have faction with XX NPC... maybe the better the faction, the better the armor.....

I think it depends n the game design on how gear should work IMO.

I think a game that has prime focus on PvP, gear should offer little but if the game is more PvE gear should be offered that has better improvements but again depends on crafting system, raid system and so on to how to distribute gear.

/takes a breath

I have decided to back this post 100%

why the difference between PvE and PvP?

If a game is designed for Player versus player then the player skill should be the prime factor in determining the outcome. A player should not have to be gear centric to compete. More and more games are making the PvP players grind to get to the prime reason they play the game. This kind of leads to a negative attitude toward the game. As an example DAoC before TOA was very populated. The gear grind in TOA forced the players to do something they did not want to do so it had a major impact in the populations of the servers.

A game designed around PvE however needs a different carrot since the players need something to strive for. The prime reason they play is different. If the games mechanical system has a prime focus on raiding then the gear needs to center around raiding. If there is no raiding then the gear should focus around loot or crafting, if and only if the crafting system is designed to be fun. Gear can play a much different role in a PvE game.

The biggest headache in todays MMO games is that the developers try to add to much of everything and they are spreading the content to thin. Larger studios may get by this but an indie developer needs to focus on one aspect and not try to build a game based on everything. The gear needs to be developed around the prime design to be successful.

Just my 2 copper,

i totally disagree with you.

PvE or PvP should both have to do with a players skill. imo, PvE is more than "who can collect the best toyz" because really... if thats the case, PvP is basically the same. why else do PvP for badges or coins or whatever to get the next best set?

imo... 1 gear set, both play styles. thats old school EQ vs WoW mentality though.